What actually creates a winning culture? with Mike Nilson Gonzaga Basketball

What actually creates a winning culture?

In this episode of the Heart First Leadership Podcast, Ryan sits down with former Gonzaga basketball player and longtime Gonzaga Director of Performance Mike Nilson for a deep conversation on culture, leadership, mindset, and personal transformation.

Mike shares stories from Gonzaga’s historic 1999 Elite Eight run, what made that culture different, and how Gonzaga sustained excellence for more than two decades. Together, we unpack the difference between simply talking about leadership and intentionally building systems that develop confidence, resilience, emotional regulation, and team culture.

This conversation goes far beyond basketball. We explore limiting beliefs, nervous system regulation, mindset conditioning, parenting, coaching, meditation, paradigm shifts, and the deep inner work required to lead others effectively.

This episode is for coaches, athletes, parents, business leaders, and anyone interested in building stronger cultures, better relationships, and a more intentional life from the inside out.

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Transcript

Welcome And Guest Background

Ryan 0:01

Welcome back to the show. Could not be more excited to have Mike Nielsen on as a guest today. I'm going to do a little introduction and a little discussion on what we're going to be talking about today, what you're going to hear, and then we'll dive right into the conversation. Mike Nielsen is a financial advisor at 10 Capital, former Gonzaga basketball player, entrepreneur, and leadership coach. He's a member of the Gonzaga's historic 1999 Elite Eight team, where Mike earned WCC Defensive Player of the Year and Academic All-Conference Honors before spending more than 20 years at Gonzaga University as a director of performance. During his time at Gonzaga, Mike helped shape one of the most respected cultures in college athletics, integrating leadership development, mindset training, performance systems, and athlete growth into the fabric of the program. Beyond basketball, Mike co-founded U District Physical Therapy and the U District Foundation, supporting youth development, mentorship, and health initiatives throughout Spokane community. Today, Mike combines his background in coaching, leadership, and performance with financial advising at 10 Capital, helping families, business owners, and athletes build long-term financial strength through personalized planning and a team-centered approach. In this episode of the Heart First Podcast, I get a chance to sit down with Mike for a deep conversation on culture, leadership, mindset, and personal transformation. Mike shares stories from Gonzaga's historic 1999 run, what made that culture different, and how Gonzaga sustained excellence for more than two decades. Together we unpack the difference between simply talking about leadership and intentionally building systems that develop confidence, resilience, emotional regulation, and team culture. This conversation goes far beyond basketball. We explore limiting beliefs, nervous system regulation, mindset conditioning, parenting, coaching, meditation, paradigm shifts, and deep inner work required to lead others effectively. This episode is for coaches, athletes, parents, business leaders, anyone interested in building stronger cultures, better relationships, and more an intentional life from the inside out. And just a little heads up if you're watching this show, either on YouTube or on another platform, we have a little technical difficulties, and the video does cut out at about the 30-minute mark, but the conversation was too powerful for us to stop. So we just continued on. So stick with us and listen to the rest of the show. I really hope you enjoy it. It is incredibly powerful. With no further ado, let's dive right in. Mike, super excited to have you here. Oh man, I'm excited to be here. Let's do this. We're in person. This is my first in-person interview outside of just my wife and I. So the new studio

Meditation Roots And Why Culture Matters

Ryan 3:05

is being used, and here we go. What do you think? Do you like it here?

SPEAKER_01 3:08

Well, just going into your neighborhood is so peaceful. I know you're kind of a Zen guy, a TM guy, a meditation guy. And I walked in and I heard the birds chirping. It got land, you know, just beautiful scenery. And so yeah, I feel at peace here. I love it.

Ryan 3:21

Let's do it. So I am super excited for multiple reasons. We're going to dive into, you know, your story, uh, Gonzaga basketball, where you've come from, and that legacy that you've been a part of for 20 on years. Is that about right? Yeah. 30 years since I stepped foot on campus. Okay, so 30 years since you've been there. But then you worked as a performance coach, met the performance coach, strength coach, all those components for 20 years. Can't wait to hear about all that. But we got connected a few months back and realized through some connection that we had some other similarities in our lives that we're passionate about. Uh everything from obviously leadership and culture and mindset and all those pieces, but also something unique uh that we're both TM practitioners.

SPEAKER_01 4:08

That is true. And the reason I'm a TM practitioner is because of you.

Ryan 4:12

Without necessarily true, but yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

Well, you know, it's kind of the way the universe works is I was on a walk and one of my buddies was telling me about TM, and I studied Ray Dalio. He says he's done TM every day for 50 years. And so it was just kind of ruminated in my head a little bit. And then one of our friends, Nolan, said, Man, Mike, you should do TM, man. It's amazing. I have this teacher named Penny, and she flies to Spokane. And I thought, you know what? Enough people from enough places are telling me I should do this. And then so it was kind of funny because when I mentioned TM and Nolan, you said, I got Nolan into TM. And so I guess I have to say thank you.

Ryan 4:49

Oh well, it's I got I we can put the line back to somebody else that's that introduced it to me. So it's just passing it down. It's it's a gift. So let's just start there. Uh, you know, I am super intrigued about culture, like how much culture means to uh a corporation, and we can talk a little bit about what you're doing there with that as well, potentially. Uh, but you know, when you look at the recipe of what it takes to create a winning culture, to win games, so to be a positive experience for everybody involved to truly make the impact you want to make, you know, this is something that previously to these last handful of years, when I was coaching collegiate football, culture to me was a kind of a something that just kind of happened, right? But you were trying to win. And I think when you look at uh, you know, the the world of athletics, Gonzaga basketball might be the absolute like front runner when it comes to intentionally developing culture and mindset. So I want to go back to the beginning of like that first Cinderella year that you were a part of uh in a 1999 season and and talk about that piece a little bit and then how that evolved for you and just the importance of it, and we'll see where the conversation goes.

SPEAKER_01 6:15

Yeah, I got to be part of something really special, and most of it was driven by relationships. It was all the stuff off the court that really taught me about life, and it's really fun to see that those guys are some of my best friends even today. You know, I've always had a weird personality quirk, kind of, you know, I for uh better or for worse, I've always loved commitment for some reason. And going into my senior year, I had this dream of playing Division I basketball, and I didn't prepare as well as I wanted to for the summer showcase tournaments. And I went down there and I kind of played scared. I I kind of played really passive. I kind of had the attitude if you don't take the shot, you can't miss the shot. Sure. And so I just was kind of on the court and I had these dreams of you know going to my mailbox and opening it up and having all the letters from colleges, and I keep them in a shoebox. And, you know, I just I just had this vision of that happening, and I didn't get any letters, and I was just really disappointed in myself, and you know, I just knew I didn't prepare the way I wanted to, and so I made a commitment. I was gonna carry a basketball with me everywhere I went until I signed my Division I scholarship papers. And a lot of people thought I was maybe a little conceited or cocky because I carried my basketball with me everywhere, but what they didn't realize it was a reminder of a time I'd failed and I was never gonna do that again. So I showed up um the first day of my senior year with the basketball, and people thought it was a little weird. I took it to class, I took it to lunch. Uh they didn't realize how serious I was. I mean, I had a special place on my pillow. I took it everywhere. And I remember I went to homecoming and I slept.

Ryan 7:48

So you even slept with it.

SPEAKER_01 7:49

Oh, I slept with this thing. You know, I just took it everywhere. Literally, uh, if you look at my uh senior year at all my school dances with my girlfriend, it was, you know, the fake backdrop with you know the trees or the flowers and me wearing a tie and with my basketball. I mean, I just took it everywhere.

Ryan 8:03

What did your girlfriend think about that?

SPEAKER_01 8:05

She thought it was kind of a joke at first, and then she kind of was like, Well, what are you doing? And then it was just kind of like who I am. It's just, you know, it's just part of me. It's just, you know, we're driving the car and we got you know the ball just sitting right there. Um, and it was it was pretty cool, you know, to see like, well, how comfortable you get with the basketball, you know, just you're always dribbling, you're always just kind of touching it. Um, but I think the stuff that really excites you and I is not the physical skills that you can build from carrying a basketball, it's the mental skills, it's just that constant reminder. I had a really good senior year, I was MVP of the league, um, but when it came time to sign my scholarship papers, I did not have one offer. And so I was, you know, like feeling a little bad. I didn't want to go to school. My actually, uh, my son's going through the same thing right now. All his friends know where they're going, and he really wants to play college basketball, and we're waiting on a couple offers. There'd be walk-on offers, but sure, um, and it's really hard, you know. He just had this happen last week. It was where your your university to school day. And so everyone was wearing their Idaho and their Gonzaga and their Arizona, and he's like, Hey dad, you know, like, do I have to go to school in the morning? You know, I don't really have class. And so, anyhow, he goes to school, and everyone, you know, said, What's the deal? Heart first, why aren't you wearing your college shirt? Well, that's how I felt. You know, I told everyone I carry the basketball every day, and so of course it's just natural. Where are you going to school? Where are you playing basketball? And I didn't know. And I was lucky enough to be able to come over and get a walk-on spot at Gonzaga, and I was so excited. Uh, but that meant I had to carry my basketball with me everywhere I went for the next year. And so I show up, and a lot of, once again, people might think I'm cocky because I'm carrying this basketball, but what they didn't know, I was so insecure. I was a walk-on, red shirt freshman, the lowest of the low. And you go, and everyone's bigger, taller, faster, stronger. They understand the plays, and that commitment really carried me through that time. Um, and I thought I was the most committed, toughest person until I met my teammates. And those guys were another level, you know, the Richie Fromms of the world, uh, Ryan Floyd's, the Matt Santangelo. I had this really awesome freshman class of guys that were just really tough. You know, I remember sitting in class with Richie, and I'd be taking notes, and he'd be taking notes, and afterwards I'd look at his notes, and he was writing his workouts for the day. And I'm like, wow, this guy's level is different. And so, you know, if you want to survive, you just gotta figure it out. So I was chasing those guys to the gym. You know, I used to play one-on-one with my buddies, and it was like you work hard on offense and on defense, it's kind of your rest time. And man, with those guys, it was like he scratched and claw every play. And so I thought they were so tough until I met John Stockton. And then, you know, he was an NBA All-Star at the time, it was the mid-90s, and he shows up in the gym, and it was like the level just went up. It was amazing, and he's so humble. I walk up to him and hey, I'm Mike Nilsson. He says, Oh, I'm John Stockton. And I'm thinking, Of course I know who you are, you know. And what I learned about him was he was not the most skilled player, he wasn't, you know, just the best athlete, all of those things. What I learned from him is he wanted to win and he was the toughest, and he would do anything to win. And he was the greatest player on the court, not because he scored the most points, it's because he assisted or served other people greater than anyone in

Carrying A Basketball As Commitment

SPEAKER_01 11:20

the history of the game. True. And so when I think about those of that Elite Eight run, of course it was my teammates, but I even think before my teammates, it was John Stockton who just is built differently. I got to play with hoops with him last week and he's 65 years old, and he's bringing the heat. So awesome. We had we had two pros there. You know, we had two G League guys that have made NBA rosters, and I'm picking John first every single time because of his mindset and because he wants to win. It's not about hey, I'm trying to work my game and I want to score. He's gonna do whatever it takes to be able to lift everyone up around him, and so yeah, that's a long answer to saying, you know, that was a special run. Um, it wasn't necessarily, I think, built by us, although we get the credit for starting the run. I really think it was started in the 80s.

Ryan 12:08

And there's always a precursor totally to success, right? And it and it leaves trails, and there's always somebody who kind of blazes the trail. Right. And and then we gotta pick up those pieces and try to figure out how do we expand them, how do we grow them? So that's what's always intriguing about Gonzaga basketball. And we were just having a conversation before we hit record. And I'm, you know, I enjoy watching the success of any program. Like, I love seeing legacy. I love seeing teams that are able. I'm a Seahaw fan. I'm hoping they go repeat, not because I'm a Seahawks fan, but because like what was the recipe that allowed them to not only be Super Bowl champs once, but do it again. And then maybe they even they find a way to do it again and like get in the heads of the players, the culture, the coaches. What's what's the daily operation look like, not just the X's and the O's, you know? And so that groundwork was laid. You guys have that Cinderella season 99, Elite Eight, and it and it's and it feels like this this new level of potential, but then you come back at what point was it immediately you came back and continue to work with the program? Like what was that transition like for you? And just talk a little bit about the program evolving and how does that consistency like happen?

SPEAKER_01 13:26

Yeah, it's it's funny to just hear how all my teammates remember it a little bit differently. I remember my freshman year walking with uh Matt Santangelo, and we were looking over at the Spokane Arena saying, How amazing would that be if we got to play in the Spokane Arena, man, and we'd have 10,000 fans there. We thought that'd be so cool. And man, and by the time we're seniors, we're not only gonna make the NC Tway tournament, we're gonna win a game. And we thought we were dreaming really big. Sure. And so I I don't know, you know, that first run, how much of it was luck, how much of it was the seeds that was you know kind of brewing, because there is an element of luck of the other team misses a shot, or you make the shot that day. There there is something that's uh out of our control. Um, I think we did a great job of controlling the controllables, but we go Elite Eight my senior year, and I think that just changed the expectations. Yeah, you know, I think you when you when we were freshmen, or at least for me, you know, I was playing like I want to win a WCC. That was like the big dream. And then, you know, my our sophomore year, we win the league, we make it to the championship game. We've already beat USF twice, and we're playing them a third time. We should win and we lose, and we get snubbed from the NC2A tournament, and that changed our mentality. We'll never be denied again. Then we get to the NC2As and we win some games, and that raised our expectation again. And so now our senior year, we make it to the Sweet 16, and then I get to go play over in Europe for a couple years. And when I'm over in Europe, I'm seeing they make another run, another sweet 16 run. And I'm like, I was just shocked. I didn't, you know, I think everyone was shocked by the the the lead eight run or the sweet 16 run. I think the real story is how they've done it for 25, 26 years. 100%. And so it's been really fun. I played overseas for a couple years. I came back, I was the assistant strength coach at Gonzaga for a year. The next year I become the head strength coach and you know, eventually director of performance and nutrition there for the past 20 plus years. And I'm in I'm in awe. I'm always just learning. I just watch Coach Few and I watch his staff. And the funny thing is, is I would do it so different. You know, I I watch him and I'm like, that interaction I would do differently, or that recruiting I would do differently, or and I'm like, well, obviously he knows what I don't know. And so I'm just I'm just watching him, you know, like I'd like I do that differently, and then I want to see how it plays out because there is some kind of magic sauce that is, I think, beyond Coach Fhew. I mean, he's definitely the visionary and he holds this high standard. I think if we look at what he does best, people think he's a genius with X's and O's, I'm sure he is. I think his expectation, his standard, his ability to be able to let certain things go that maybe are not the essential core things and hold other things to a higher standard than anyone expects. It's his coaching staff's amazing. I think it's the administration, the way they support them, and you know, you have to put boundaries on, and they do a great job of knowing what boundaries to put on and where to give them leeway. I think it's spoken in the community. I mean, I do think it's this magic sauce because we've seen other great coaches that have been in the program that have been successful other places, but not what Coach Few has done. And so um I I love to you know share my thoughts on it, but I'm still trying to figure it out. You know, I just I was just chatting with them this past uh past week. We did our uh end of the year bank for Gonzaga Prep. Coach Few's son and my son play hoops together at G Prep, and so it's been so fun to watch the games together and be able to spend time with them. And part of it is there's a friendship there and there's uh respect, you know, being colleagues, but then there's also this level of kind of admiration, or you know, like he would be a mentor looking like, how how has he done this level of excellence? And I can't believe, you know, I was watching the um Road to the Gold or something like that. It was a Netflix special on the on the Olympics, and I'm watching LeBron James and Steph Curry and KD, and I'm like, this is amazing. And I see Coach Few and I'm like, I forget he's pretty special, yeah. And so I'm just trying to take it all in and learn.

Ryan 17:38

Yeah, so it it's incredible to watch that longevity and and and think about it as this huge recipe where it does take the entire community, it takes the administration all the way down to the recruiting piece with the players and all those pieces. Let's come back and let's unpack a little bit more your role and how that morphed and how you where you saw value because of that piece that you were intimately involved in is a very strong component, and I think one of the pieces that, like I said, makes Gonzaga the front runner is their intentionality behind the mental aspect of the game, the culture aspect of the game. I even just saw something recently where Coach Fhew was talking about how much time they spend percentage-wise on that part, and it was like 25 to 30 percent that he mentioned how they do that with these sessions where either the coaches are in the room or not in the room and and all of these pieces. I would love to hear how that over the course of your time there and your involvement and how you see the value of that unfolding during those 20 years.

SPEAKER_01 18:47

Yeah, I've learned a lot as a player from my teammates, and I've learned a lot more as a coach in in you know what happens behind the closed doors. You know, I didn't have access to a lot of the information, but I think my teammates were amazing when I was a player. What made us so good is that we celebrated all the roles. You know, you mentioned administration and you mentioned even the Spokane community, the fans. I mean, I think all of it plays a part in Gonzaga's success. Um, but for me as a player, I was not a great scorer. You know, I was not a flashy offensive player, I was just a good all-around utility player. You know, I was a leading scorer in my high school basketball team, scoring 13 points a game. So I wasn't dropping 30. I just always like making the right play. I didn't have that, you know, maybe that switch that maybe some great offensive players have. Like I just watched that um The Slipper Still Fits documentary with Adam Morrison, and I forget the fierce competitor this guy was. It was almost yeah, it was almost like it was some weird obsession. You see him slamming the ball and hitting his head, and he just he wanted to compete on the offensive end so bad. And I think I kind of did the opposite where you know I I maybe had a harder time with the confidence on offense, but um on defense, I almost like you know, took whatever lack of confidence or aggressiveness there, and I put it on the other end. Sure. And the reason why I think I was able to do that so well is because I had teammates that were excited about it. You know, it was like whatever, Richie Fromm might drop 30, but the he was more excited about me holding the other guy to six points. And I remember we were playing uh, gosh, it was some Texas team, and they had the leading uh score in the nation at the time. And he said, Man, if you hold me the single digits, I'll buy you a Gatorade. And you know, we know it's not just me, it's in defense is five people, but I always had the assignment, and with the help of everyone, we held them to maybe

Toughness Lessons From Elite Teammates

SPEAKER_01 20:45

eight points or something. He was he was so excited for me. Like it was like I dropped 30, and that was just normal. It was like everyone celebrated the guy that rebounded, the guy that passed it, the guy that shot it, the bench player that was cheering everyone on. And I can just say, you know, that that stuff's real. That what I really felt that, you know, I was really excited for my friends and family to come and watch the game because I felt like I was a huge part of it coming off the bench as a sophomore as a junior, getting my two minutes because I was gonna get in and get a stop, and everyone celebrated. So I think that was really special. I don't know if it was as intentional because I wasn't, you know, I wasn't part of the coaching staff. But now on the other side, being the director of performance and getting to work with Travis Knight, who really sees the value, and I think he's been part of the driving force for this. He really has coaches for you's ear and respect. And you know, the progression as a strength coach is when you first get hired on, you think, my number one job is to get everyone stronger, and you think that's your priority. And then you realize pretty quick that you don't get stronger in the weight room, you actually get weaker. You know, if you can do twenty pull ups when you walk in the weight room, you can only do five or ten when you leave, you break down your body, sure, and so you start realizing wow, that recovery, whether it's nutritional. Or meditation or sleep, whatever that is, that piece is really good. You know, that's that's where you build yourself back up. And then we spend a lot of time and energy in that area only to realize, well, yeah, that might build the best athletes, but we we're gonna be competing against the North Carolinas, the UCLAs, the Texas, and if we're trying to if we're gonna try and compete on athleticism, we're probably not gonna win. And what Travis really saw was the mental piece, the culture piece, the leadership piece, all the stuff that helps and enhances those skills on the court. And so, yeah, we went from probably not spending any financial resources and spending a little bit of time on it to spending a lot of financial resources, a lot of time, a lot of care is part of our recruiting process. You know, we talk about our leadership programs. Uh, Travis has his programs are called Stepbacks, um, and they're doing them on a weekly basis. Um, you know, I've been part of the women's basketball team. We have an 18-week leadership program that all the coaches and the players participate. We call it the leadership loop. And it's not just a leadership plan, it's a leadership system, how you take people from their first year to their second year to their fourth year and life beyond. Because we really believe that leadership is the most important skill in sport. More important than shooting, dribbling, passing. We really believe that leadership enhances all those other skills. And if you don't have leadership, oh, team can fall apart. And so we think leadership will help you get the most amount of wins and the most success on the court. And then it's the only skill really that transcends sport. Yeah. And so we've just doubled down on it, and not only has it equated to a lot of wins, the process has been so much more fun. You know, being a coach in the locker room, being on the court or in the weight room, and when you have grateful people that have uh a growth mindset and are gritty and have you know gratitude, man, it makes it for a fun season. So even if it did not equate to more wins, the process is so much more fun.

Ryan 24:06

Yeah, yeah. I think of the idea of vertical development versus horizontal development. All the things that are performance-based, that are skill-based and strength-based are all horizontal development, right? And the multiplier, I tell the team all this when I'm working with them. The multiplier is the vertical development, like the confidence, the leadership, the mindfulness, all those components, right? And learn how to use the mind, uh, the breath work, all those pieces that we talk about is the multiplier to the horizontal development, right? And and that also, like you said, yeah, maybe it doesn't exactly equate. And here's the hard part with it is that how do we actually measure it? Because we're either doing it or we're not doing it in one year to the next, maybe it turns into more wins. And I think one of the pieces that yet still hasn't been accepted in the athletic world completely at all levels, is I think a lot of strength coaches, I think a lot of sports coaches as well think they're doing leadership development. They think they're working on mindset because they talk about being gritty or they have a little post-practice talk, or they, you know, in a in a team meeting say this or that or the other, or in during the lift, a strength coach is, you know, pushing them. And so they think, well, of course I'm working on mental toughness, of course I'm working on emotional regulation, of course I'm working on leadership. Right. I would love to hear a little bit like, what does it look like to go from it just being kind of just a happenstance to it being truly intentionally laced into the program? Where like what does that look like? So one more one more one more quick thought, to make sure that somebody who's listening can go like, oh, I thought I was doing it. That's my personal, I might be wrong, but my personal belief is the majority of the world, 80% at least, thinks they're doing it, versus truly intentionally creating cultural leadership and mental toughness and those things.

SPEAKER_01 25:59

We're gonna have to do a 20-part series on this because this is so fun. And I love learning from you. I've never heard the horizontal and vertical component, and it makes so much sense. And I think it is measurable. Uh, you know, it may be harder to measure than other things, but it's so measurable because I just went through this. My son Carter and I, we did this four-day event, and it was uh like a mental performance event. And we're, you know, it's 12 hours a day, we're in this room together, we're trying to figure stuff out, and we picked one limiting belief that we're gonna work on. He picked one that had to do with basketball and confidence, and I picked one about being a good husband and some of the limiting beliefs that I had, that I was just kind of had my open, you know, I've been married for 25 years this year, and it's amazing to think that I thought I was doing, or at least I thought I had the right vision. Maybe I don't always complete it, maybe I don't have the self-discipline to always do the right thing, but I thought I always knew the right thing to do. And then I have this, you know, this mentor that shows me a better way of doing it. And so I'm gonna work on one man um limiting belief, and my son's gonna work on the other one. And we go through this Charles Dickinson process, which is kind of cool. It's the Ebenezer Scrooge story. It's the idea of you can change anything with enough leverage, and so this limiting belief that my son has and confidence. Well, the reason he hasn't changed it yet is he doesn't have enough leverage to change it. And I thought that was kind of interesting, you know. I I I'd never thought that you could change someone else, especially if someone else doesn't want to change.

Ryan 27:32

Sure.

SPEAKER_01 27:33

And this Tony Robbins was a guy I was, you know, listening to, and he says, You can change anyone with enough leverage. And he said, Look at Ebenezer Scrooge.

Sustaining Gonzaga Excellence For Decades

SPEAKER_01 27:40

He lived his entire life a certain way, and in one night, he totally changed. He had a dream and he saw the pain that not only caused himself, but his community and the people he cared about. And he saw what he's doing now, today, to harm himself and the people he loves. And if he didn't change, what it would look like in five or ten and twenty years. And the pain was so much, the leverage was so much that he wanted to change. I'm like, oh, I'm game, I'll do this, you know. So my son closes his eyes, I close my eyes, and Tony takes us through this process. Start thinking about all the pain you've caused. I'm thinking about, you know, the times with my wife, and you know, Carter's doing the same thing with basketball, but I can hear him going, Air is breathing. And I'm like, is he is he crying? You know, I'm just like, you know, all of a sudden, like, you know, the focus just zooms in. And then I can hear him breathing more and more. And Tony's going, imagine all the times you let yourself down. Think about all the times you were disappointed in yourself, and all the times you didn't have confidence, and and think about all the people that you've harmed, all the people you really love and you care about and you left down. He's really digging into this, making it really painful. And I could see my son crying, I literally just crying, just thinking about the times that he was scared because of the stupid limiting belief. And then Tony's he lays into it, he's like, Oh, but but don't blame yourself. It's you know, you're a victim, you know. He's just really making you feel like, oh, you know, like, gosh, I'm weak. And then he goes to present day. And I'll think about even the pain is causing you right now in this moment, just knowing that you don't have control over this thing, and and think about the people you're hurting right now, the people that you love and care about, the respect that you're losing from them because of this limiting belief. You know, and then he goes to the future in five years. How painful would that be if you didn't change? What would you say to yourself if you didn't change? And my son screams, I hate you. And now I'm just bawling my eyes out, you know, and and I'm thinking, why does my son have this lack of confidence? And then it hit me hard. He's played Sunday hoops with me every Sunday for the last four years with me and my buddies, and he's heard me tell him, Man, he play with confidence, he play with passion. You owe it to your teammates to take the right shot, you know. This is what a good teammate meets. And then he watches me on the court passing up shots, you know, getting a little scared. I miss a shot, I don't take the other shot. He hears what I say to myself, I'm old, I suck, I don't want to play, you know. He hears this, and you know, if it was a drug thing, you know, if I was doing drugs and I looked and saw my son doing drugs, it would be an easy transition to be like, he's doing that because of me. Man, it hit me hard, and I'm like, oh my gosh, I had to go reverse and think about all the times I've hurt him and all the people I've hurt and my teammates. And I immediately switched and said, you know, I'm coming up on 50 years old, and I have this weird, limiting belief that I could pretend like it's not that big of a deal. Oh, it's just a silly game. No, my son is really hurting because of this. And I think, man, how many Sundays have I just wasted being scared to play hoops? I'm old, you know, like, and like I should be confident. What am I doing? Like, you know, I should I should be the mature one out there, and so make a long story short, he makes it so painful. I'm like, I don't want to change, I have to change. The leverage was so strong. And then the cool thing about this was now you have this huge drive, but he says it's it's not over yet. The next part is you know, you're gonna want to go back. This is not it's kind of like getting strong. You go in the weight room and you have a six pack, but if you stop lifting weights, the mind is a muscle too. Yep. So you're gonna want to go put this old record, this old CD back in. Revert back to the old pattern. Sure. To the old pattern. He says you got to interrupt the pattern. And so what you're gonna do is you're gonna take that old limiting belief, you're gonna use your whole body, and then you gotta do something silly and make it so obvious that this limiting belief is a small, stupid thing. It is ridiculous. You're going like this, and I'm, you know, my son's watching me, and I gotta do this whole thing with my body, and then you gotta pick your nose. And he's like, and you can't pretend like you're picking it. Dig in there. Stick it up there, dig in there. And then he said, and then what you have to do is you have to use your funniest Mickey Mouse, silly, stupid voice, and make this voice in your head just take all the power out of it. So you have to go, I have no confidence on the court, and then you have to like then you have to get your chest up, change your physiology, change your state, and you have to, that's BS. I put the work in, and I deserve to take the shot, you know. And then he would do it, and then I go again. And do we do we lose it? It's all good. Finish the thread. Then we do it again. I stick my vote, I'm scared. What if I miss a shot? You know, and then be like, that's BS, you know? Every missed shot is an opportunity to go get a grab a rebound and get a stop, you know. And you just do it, and by the end of this 30, 45 minute thing, my chest is up. And so the reason I tell you all this is because I saw a huge transformation in him, but the biggest transformation I saw was in with him uh was myself. You know, uh the next week we go play Sunday hoops. Now, throughout the whole week, I'm doing visualization, and the crazy thing about the visualization is I'm closing my eyes to visualize, and I'm doing the simple mic and drill where you do a right-hand layup, left hand layup. I mean, you know, any high school college player makes 20 out of 20 easy, you know, and I play professional basketball. I'm doing this, I can't make a shot. And I'm like, you know, my this thing was so deeply ingrained in me, this fear of making a mistake and shooting, that of course, you know, like it wasn't just as simple as, hey, tell your kids go shoot the basketball. This stuff is deep rooted and you need to do work with it. So I start slowing down, and I visually have to really slow down and see it hit the backboard, and it wants to go somewhere else, and I just see it guide gently into the rim, and I just do it. I just go really slow. And once I could start making every one of those layups, I could start making jump shots, and then I go out in the garage, we have a little hoop out there, and I start actually doing the layups, and I start feeling good, and then I start once I still have the confidence, I started picturing my teammates on the court with me, and I pictured someone, you know, like watching me from the the window, and okay, now people are watching me. How is this gonna feel? And I just worked on it all week, and now I go to Sunday hoops. There's no way I'm letting my son down. No way. I I mean I that Dickinson process changed me. Yep. I get the ball for the first time. Now, people for the last 20 years are not guarding my 15 footer. So I step up, I'm right there, and I'm like, boom, I hit the first jumper. You know, I'm like, let's go. I get it again, pup fake, layup. And I'm like, I played the best I played in probably 10 years. It felt so good. Now, the reason I mentioned the story is because you said it's hard to measure the mental thing. Well, I just played last weekend, and the reality is I don't practice like I used to practice. I went about three for twenty on Sunday. You know, I made a couple layups, I missed a lot of layups. I missed, you know, but the thing is I took them, and so when I was talking with my son on Sunday afterwards, my wife was there, and

Turning Leadership Into A Real System

SPEAKER_01 34:55

we were like, man, that was so cool, dad. You know, like I I asked Carter, how many shots do you think I would have taken a year ago? He said, probably three. How many did I take today? Twenty. That's measurable. You know, like I and it wasn't 20 shots like I was forcing it. There were 20 of the right shots.

Ryan 35:12

And measure by the process.

SPEAKER_01 35:14

Measure by the process. Now, if I put the practice in, I'll make more of those shots. Sure. But I just love the idea that I did it. And so, you know, as you go through, I think, you know, what I love about strength conditioning is because it's really what I needed to help me get to the next level. What I love about the nutrition or what I love about the mental performance is what I needed, and I still need to this day. And so I think, you know, to go back to what you're saying, the person listening, it's really easy for a coach to be like, I told this player to work hard, or I told this player to shoot it, or I told this player to be a good leader. And I would say, boy, that's like telling a player, I told them to dunk from the free throw line. Do they physically have the skills or do they mentally have the skills to do it? And I really believe leadership is a skill, just like shooting, dribbling, passing. And my thought with it would be is I don't expect the high school coach or the strength coach to be able to teach it if they don't know how to teach it. I think the value that you have is that you've studied not just leadership and mental performance, you've studied all the disciplines, and you see these capital T truths that govern not just one area, but they govern all areas. And I love that. And I think you have the actual ability to teach it. I I can't teach anyone how to play the violin. I don't know how to play. You know, I I can tell when it's gone wrong, but I don't know how to help someone when it's gone right. And so that's why I love chatting with you, is because I'm learning from you the whole time, and and my system's not the perfect system, but I would challenge anyone if you want to have a team full of great leaders, can you define what leadership is? And if you can't define what leadership is, then can you really teach it? Or do you know what you're teaching? And then I would say, uh, I heard this quote and I it really changed the way that I coached. And he said, Average leaders have quotes, good leaders have a plan, exceptional leaders have a system. And that rocked me because you look at the previous 10, 20 years I was coaching, and I had a lot of quotes. I am I'm an avid reader like you are. Man, I read this thing today. Let me tell you about this thing I learned. And the next week I learned read this other thing, and it was these quotes, but I didn't have a plan. And then I think what's really powerful is when you get to coach at the college level, at least when I was coaching, you got athletes for four or five years. It's not just a plan or a workout, it's a system, not only to take them through their college years, but to take them through life. And so, you know, even as a strength conditioning coach, I think you can use the same quote. Average strength coaches have exercises. They go on Instagram and they say, Oh, this cool thing with the bosu ball or a band or this cool kettlebell thing. That's what an average strength coach does. A good strength coach has a plan. I know how the exercise fits into the flow for that day, into my mobility, and it goes into my plyometrics, into my strength, into my cooldown. I have a plan now. But an exceptional strength coach has a system for how to do that for the freshman that's a freak athlete and the senior that might transfer, that might be older, but doesn't have the experience. And they can say, I can progress that kid. And so it's a lot more complicated than people think. You know, if we look at, hey, how do you teach someone how to do rocket science? Like, well, I don't know how to do that, you know. And so you'd leave it to the experts or you'd study. Uh, I think with leadership, you think, oh gosh, I played basketball or I played football, I'll be a good leader. And they don't realize there are these laws and these truths and these principles and these structures that there's there's there's a reason why you've studied your whole life, and the more you study, the more you want to study because the more you learn, like, wow, this this is really intricate, and it's more complicated than just this fancy quote, and hey, I told them to toughen up and they didn't. It's the athlete's fault. Right. And so, yeah, I've it's a learning journey for me. I have this structure that's been great to anchor to, but I'm I'm learning, you know, and you just realize that just because I solved my problem for one day, there's gonna be another thing that comes up that you have to be a master at being able to take those principles and your strategy and use the right technique at the right time.

Ryan 39:30

So the question is do you have a system for culture, for leadership development, for mental toughness? And and to peel back for a moment because you just gave me permission on something, and I want to thank you like from the bottom of my heart, actually, almost just making me emotional, just thinking about it. One of the things that is the most near and dear to my heart is something that we call shadow integration, which is basically what my what uh Tony Robbins was doing with you and your son in that type of experience. It's if you look at the science behind how you explained it, it's paradigm shifting. We have to observe something, bring it to the surface, bring it to our conscious workshop to be able to let it go and then shift our physiology, our attention, what we're focusing on, to something that's future-oriented, that's impact-oriented, experiential-oriented, right? That's how we do paradigm shifting, right? And using, in his case, in that case, he was actually using something from Victor Frankel called paradoxical intention. And paradoxical intention is where we almost bring humor in to make fun of ourselves to go, like, how ridiculous is this limiting belief that I'm stupid or I'm not good enough, or I'm not this, that, or whatever enough, right, to be able to go do, right? And to your point, with a coach saying, Well, I told them to do X, Y, and Z. And maybe they just don't have it in them. This is something I've been challenging coaches on recently, is to say there is probably something emotional that's blocking them from being able to lead, from being able to do these different things that you want them to do. If they have the physical ability, right, and they're not doing it. It's some sort of limiting belief. It's some sort of an avoidance strategy that's keeping them from taking that risk, from taking that shot, right? And we can expose that. And so the permission that you gave me is for me to actually take another very authentic step in the direction of being willing to bring that more deeper, emotional, even semi-spiritual type of work to the forefront of what I do because I've talked about mental toughness and culturability and all these pieces. But to me, that's the real thing that we're really doing. So the question becomes for anybody who's listening is like if you're just doing it, it's not doing it. Like it's just a quote, just the plan, it has to be a system. There has to be intention, reflection, feedback loops. There has to be something that takes somebody from point A to point B, but point B to point C, freshman to sophomore, and beyond, right? And then the real tricky part this time of year or this season uh of of our existence is the is the amount of transferring that happens. So, like for Eastern football, for example, there's gonna be 40 new bodies. 40 new bodies in the fall camp that there was in the winter, right? And I'm like, how do we continue to progress the 65 guys that were there there in the winter? Right, and then also onboard the 40 new bodies and catch them up or get them going in the right direction with all these skills. Like that's a fascinating, complex puzzle piece uh experiment and journey.

SPEAKER_01 42:41

Absolutely. I think you have to, in my opinion, I think you have to include that thing because the paradigm shift is so powerful. And if we all really look inside, we can see that you know, we all have that same thing that that athlete we're trying to help us struggling with. You know, I I was in, you know, the whatever the football coach's shoes as a strength coach. Why can't this athlete just do this? Why can't they show up on time? Why can't they

Limiting Beliefs And Measuring Progress

SPEAKER_01 43:10

be more vocal? Whatever that thing is. And I just have no compassion or no understanding because I'm not looking inside and seeing the one thing I've struggled with for 40 years with the confidence issue. Oh gosh, well, yeah, if it's so easy, just if someone tells you to do something, why can't I do it? You know, it's easy to see with people that want to lose weight. You know, you probably have people on the coaching staff that are like, oh gosh, I don't my back hurts, and you know, I have my doctor's telling me that my cholesterol is high and you know, my stress is high, and they're not taking care of themselves physically. Why aren't they? You know, it's not a do problem, or excuse me, it's it's not a no problem. Everyone knows that you should, you know, eat well and exercise. It's a due problem. So why are they doing what they should do? I think they need a paradigm shift because they think they know what they know, but they Actually don't. And it was the same thing. I thought I knew what I was telling my son. Be aggressive. You know, I I know this. Well, if I'm not doing it, I don't know it. And I read a story, uh, I think it was uh maybe Stephen Covey talked about paradigm shift, and it gave me this big aha moment. And he describes a paradigm shift through a story. He says, uh, this businessman has a long day, this lawyer, and he goes on the subway. All he wants to do is read his newspaper in peace and just unwind. You know, he's pretty stressed out. He's he steps on the subway, and at the very first stop, a dad and two boys come in, and the boys start running up and down the you know, the the rail or the bus or whatever he was on, and the guy is telling himself, calm down, it's okay, they're little kids, just let them run. But inside he's just like anxious, like, gosh darn it, you know, and then the kids run down, now they start screaming, and then in his head he's like, Why can't this dad just discipline the dang kids? Like, be a decent father for crying out loud. He's like, But calm down. He's just really trying, he's trying to do the right thing. And finally, one of the kids runs and hits his paper. He can't handle anymore. Dang it! He just yells at the dad, why did you take care of your kids? Show some discipline. And the dad looks up out of this daze and says, I'm so sorry. We just left the hospital, their mom just died, and I don't know what to do. And in one instant, this lawyer that was so uptight didn't have to try any harder. He just knew, oh my gosh, of course, let those boys run. You know, like and I think, man, that's how the paradigm shift worked worked for me. And I love how you know Tony has a system. It's not his universal principles. He probably learned them from Victor Frankel or from whoever.

Ryan 45:51

Combination of a lot of things, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:52

Combination, and he put it into his system, and so that's what we've done at Gonzaga. The leadership loop are not our you know, principles, our truths. We just said, man, this fits our personality, this fits our language, this fits our culture, this is how we're gonna package it together. And so to me, I think you know, I needed a paradigm shift. I've been trying for a lot of years, like, oh man, I I should have more confidence, but then I talk myself out of it. Oh, I I don't care that much, you know. The person that might maybe wants to lose a lot of weight, oh, who cares?

Ryan 46:24

You know, like just justify, rationalize, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:28

I'm I'm not 20 anymore, I don't need to have a six-pack. And so I was doing the same thing. And I then I would try for periods of time, I'd read a cool book and I'd be really good for two weeks, and I'd go back to my old self. And that happened for years, and I think the paradigm shift is the key. And so when you're telling me, you know, you have permission now to go and dig deep, and I'm like, I don't know if I would have changed any other way. You know, I think if I had a coach, he would have been fighting me against something that was just inside. He would have he'd been fighting the symptoms, but not the cause.

Ryan 46:59

Yeah. I guess when I say you give me permission, I mean that deep emotional work is a foundation of everything that we do, it's laced in, right? But to be like up front with it and to help uh even a team of football players, you know, 105 guys, be able to expose one limiting belief and to and to shift it. And what we're talking about is actually healing. And and our and in your point, your kids are the absolute number one mirror. We just did a workshop last week for ETS uh performance gym in in Quarter Lane. And the request was what do we do for the car ride home? Parents want to know how they can do a better job. They could recognize that that's not a healthy uh piece or they need help making it healthy. And one of the number one pieces that I that I led with was that if they're struggling with confidence, so are you. It's that simple. My wife and I saw this well over a decade ago, and we understand we understood memory and perception. We we found a perception specialist who taught us this shadow integration work. And it was incredibly clear to me once you really understood how perception and projection, these things work, how our minds work as a projector screen, how we're this basically projecting our limiting beliefs onto our children. And as much as we don't want to or try not to or whatever, like it's it's an unconscious transfer of energy, of belief, right, through our language, through our words, through the tone of our voice, through our body language. And so if I want my son to be confident, my number one priority is to do things that make me confident at the end, to let go of the story, right? Let go of the story, let go of the belief, and focus on. I love the word, I love that you use the words principle and law. Like that is exactly in alignment. Like I'm I'm feeling like we you and I just should start a podcast together because we can go on forever. But that piece, I think, even in the case of a coach, right? If your team is not at the level that you want them to be at from a cultural perspective, from a leadership perspective, from a mental toughness or confidence perspective, as a parent or as a coach, as a corporate leader, take a look in the mirror. Take a look in the mirror because that's where it's coming from. Right. And this is a bitter truth that's hard, maybe to like, oh, that's kind of uh no, but they should, and why don't no, there it is. There's the justification. Well, yeah, but no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, don't do that. Don't go into story, do your work as a parent. Right. And then you're not otherwise, and here's the the real bitter truth you're gonna pass it on. If you don't clean up your insides as a father, as a mother, whatever, you will pass it on to your children, whatever form of limiting belief or lack or that you're currently operating from. And like I once I realized that well over a decade ago, I was like, oh, this is my only priority. Everything else, yes, I'm building businesses and doing things and making it whatever, but like that's the most important thing I can do is my own internal work. And that's legitimately what motivates me to sit down and transcend every single day and meditate every day and do that work because then I know I'm I'm excavating, I'm cleaning things out, so I'm passing on less, and hopefully I'm passing on, and there'll be some things I didn't catch or didn't get to, right? And that's fine, but making sure I'm creating the best possible environment. Best possible environment. Not perfect, best possible.

SPEAKER_01 50:36

I love that, man. I mean, yeah, your family's so lucky that you're doing that, and even if you don't solve everything, I think just the example of the work that you're putting in. You know, I think about uh how lucky I was to have my parents. I saw my mom work hard every day in the home, and I saw my dad

Parenting And Coaching As The Mirror

SPEAKER_01 50:55

go out and work hard. And what a cool example for me to be able to be like, you know, I think more things are caught than taught. They didn't have to teach me about hard work, although I I think that is part of it. I think it is part of like to point out my mom will tell us, like, oh man, I loved, I live to serve, you know, and here's why, and this is why this is so great. And you know, I get to see her doing it, and she kind of explains the the why behind the what to. Um, yeah, and so I think what a cool example of your kids are gonna know, hey man, if I want to be a great guitar player, you put in work, you know, guitar. If I want to have great relationships, you put in work. If you want to have inner peace, it's probably not gonna happen. What do they say? You don't have to water weeds, the weeds are gonna grow on their own. And so I love that you're doing that. And I think that's what's a little scary for coaches, because man, I want my players to have this sense of gratitude. Well, what you're saying is then the coaches probably should have a sense of gratitude. 100%. It's really difficult if you're the whole time complaining about everything's wrong and how the players don't do anything, and how the administration's this, and then you hand them a new pair of shoes and the players aren't very happy, and you're like, oh, these kids are so ungrateful. They're entitled. Yeah, and I think, wow, boy, it definitely is challenging because as a parent and as a coach, we got to raise our standards if we want to raise the standards of the team and the culture. And so, uh, but it's it's not just easy, you know, it's it's not like getting a degree. Boom, I have my college degree, I have it forever. It is a lot more like working out, which is every day, just something you have to do. And those muscles, they don't know, you know, that you really want them to be strong unless you actually challenge them. Yeah, you know, that that stress, that strain, that resistance, that's what builds, you know, strong muscles. And so I think, yeah, the conditioning part is really challenging because you can read a really good book and you can maybe even have a paradigm shift, but you need to condition it.

Ryan 52:46

Well, and if you don't condition it, you'll go slip back, like Tony said, back into the old pattern. Yeah, because old patterns are strong. But that's why you just stay keeping that mental and emotional and spiritual aspect up front. Right. And then everything else seems to take care of itself. It really, really, truly does, you know. So, well, this has been fascinating and uh and thoroughly enjoyed it. Let's give one takeaway, let's give one thing, let's simplify because we didn't get to the actual theme that I thought we we were gonna get to, which maybe we'll do another one at a later date. But give us with just one like piece to get started. Right. So I'm a father and I'm listening, I'm a coach and I'm listening, maybe I'm a I'm I'm a an entrepreneur, I'm a leader of some sort, right? Because what we just talked about is this huge system and it's complex. And what I don't want is for someone to listen to this and be like, okay, what's the point? I don't even know where to get started. Right.

SPEAKER_01 53:47

To me, I think there's kind of three parts, and I heard this guy tell this story and I really liked it. He said these three parts are crucial, but the order is even more crucial. It's like a combination lock. You can have the right numbers, but if they're in the wrong order, it doesn't work. And so one of those pieces is strategy. And so I think that's what everyone listening probably wants is like, hey, what's the next step? What book can I read? What conversation can I have? And strategy is really important, but your strategy is dictated by your story, what you tell yourself. And you know, there's two stories that are true, you know, what you don't have and what you do have, and both of those are true. Which one are you going to focus on? And what you focus on is dictated by your state or your physiology. And when you have a really good state, a good physiology, it's amazing how your story changes and it's good, and then your strategy can be even better. And this hits home to me. I I I love doing all this reading stuff. Most of it's kind of selfish because I'm always just like, I want to feel good, I want to look good, I want to perform well, I want to be a great dad. You know, all of it is, you know, I just have this drive for some reason. And we're doing this year of health with my family, with my four siblings, or the my three brothers and my older sister. And I was really excited for them to do it. One of my brothers is 350 pounds, and I thought, man, I'd be so excited. What kind of father and what kind of husband could he be? He'd be in less pain. You know, he could get out and have more confidence. I was really excited for him to do this year of health. And when it came time for me, I'm like, well, you know, maybe I'll maybe I'll commit to working out three times a week, you know, in the morning. And, you know, I I was just like, I wasn't that inspired. And then I did started doing some goal setting. And I had this was guided goal setting, and it started talking about what do you really want? You know, like if you didn't have to worry about the how, if you could just have what you really wanted, how do how would you want to look and how would you want to perform? And I started thinking, you know, it was 195 pounds at the time, and I'm like, what if I was 205? You know, 205, man, I'd feel pretty good, you know. But they kept going, man, how would he perform on the basketball court, you know? And and what about when you went to Hawaii? How would I feel how good would that feel to take your shirt off and have your kids go like, dang, dad, you know? And pretty soon I started dreaming 215, and it was amazing how when I really dreamt and I was feeling good and I was inspired, how I got to 220. And so now my story changed. Instead of, yeah, I'm gonna try and work out, you know, a few times a week, you know, and maybe I'll maybe I'll gain a couple pounds. Like, no, I'm gonna put on 20 pounds of muscle.

Ryan 56:24

Let's go.

SPEAKER_01 56:24

So where are you at? Well, now I'm up 15 pounds. Let's go. Not all muscle, but I'm up. But I the biggest thing was not necessarily the result, it's been the process. Yeah. Because when you want to put on five pounds, your strategy is a lot different than if you want to put on 20 pounds of muscle and be a freak athlete. And so when you do that, all of a sudden I said, Well, I can't do this alone. I better join a workout group. So now I have four of my buddies who we work out in the morning. And so not only am I doing harder workouts than I've ever done, I'm having fun and I'm connecting. And then I start saying, Well, that's three days a week. What should I do the other two days a week? What if I went to Gonzaga and work out with my other buddies down there? And so now I'm working out way more than when I had a small goal and I was at a story of like, oh, I'm doing it for somebody else. And when I got really excited, man, all this sort of, you know, my strategy is better, I'm feeling better, my results are better. So if you said, what's one takeaway? Whether it's I want to be a better parent, I want to be a better coach, I want to be better for myself, the one thing I would say is, man, get in that right state. Really dream. Really look inside and don't worry about the how. The how will will make you scared and make you not want to do it. You know, if my brother's 350 pounds, if he thinks about being 200 pounds, it's too daunting. How am I gonna do it? And my back hurts, and I got in a car accident, it's too challenging. But if you can dream and then you can change your story, then all of a sudden that strategy becomes way better and the process is way better. So that's where I would start.

Ryan 57:57

Yeah, we actually say state before skill or regulate before communicate. So as a leader, the first step would be you gotta learn first how to regulate your state, how to shift your state, right? That's everything Tony teaches, right? Inter pattern

State Shapes Story Shapes Strategy

Ryan 58:10

interrupt state before before skill. Because the story that you're telling yourself has more to do with the state you're in. And just so in case you guys don't know, state means how you're thinking, how you're feeling, and your behaviors are or actions that you're taking that get your results, right? So if you don't like the results you're having in life, you don't like, you know, you want to have bigger, better stories, better stories to create better strategy, is what I'm hearing. That it starts with your state because your state is dictating the story that you're telling about yourself, right? It's actually a nervous system state. If we like to look at it as a as like a stoplight, green, it's green as ge uh gleaming and beaming, right? Like that story, the dreaming that you'll create from a green state is gonna be expansive, it's gonna be big, impactful. Yellow is gonna be like slow down, danger, right? Like, oh no, am I good enough? And uh, what the what's the point and whatever. And that that dreaming, those the stories are gonna be more diminishing, less empowering. And then red is like, you know, threat, right? You know, so like those stories are gonna not gonna be self-serving at all. So first, regulate, learn how to shift your state. Totally love that. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Mike. This has been a pleasure. And I want and just thank you for your friendship and everything that you're doing, because you're taking all of this and you're now doing it in business as a leader there, not only in your own family, still connected in some way, shape, or form, it sounds like with Gonzaga as well. And then obviously now bringing it into the professional world as well, which I think is just a beautiful thing, like those three different categories. So thank you so much for your time.

SPEAKER_01 59:50

Thank you for your friendship. Thank you for what you're doing for the community, and yeah, just an honor to be here. Yeah, thanks, Mike.